Sam: My life story could be a soap opera. Well, I'm from Vietnam. I escaped from Vietnam in 1979 and back in ‘80 people called it “boat people” because we ride the boat from Vietnam. It’s like nothing is guaranteed. You may die at sea, you may get hijacked by the pirates, you know, you never know what would happen and then somehow be here. So I’ve been here 42, 43 years now.

Mireya: So how old were you when you came here?

Sam: 20, I think 21.

Mireya: You were 21?

Sam: Twenty one. 

Mireya: That's pretty late. So you, you remember being on the boat?

Sam: Of course. Yeah.

Mireya: How was that experience?

Sam:I was on a small boat, like 20, 32 ft. At least, I forgot how many people, at least 400 people in the boat. 400 people. 

Mireya: On the small boat? Wow!

Sam: That's why that's happening. So we get from there and then we've been at sea for seven days, the ocean for seven days, every day and night. So finally we arrived at the Malaysian refugee camp. We spent two years there before I came to the United States. That's right.

Mireya: You were with your family?

Sam: No, at that time, me and my brothers, we got no brother, our family stay in Vietnam. So I moved here back in ‘81. Since then, I’m here.

Mireya: You went straight to Philly?

Sam: First to New York for 48 hours. I didn't like New York at that time. New York costs a lot of money, it’s too much rain. The living environment is no good. So it was very bad in New York. The housing, the rent is high. You don’t get a car or anything. It’s so big. I couldn’t handle it. So I came to Philly to check out. Since then, I’ve been here for 40, 42 years now.

Mireya: That's a long time. You, you talked about being called Sam: is that what your family calls you?

Sam: That's my real name for General Sam Sam. In French, it’s different in Vietnamese. They got some comma and on top of it. So that last name, Sam. The first name should be something else and come to the United States. They cut everything, they just don’t use any comma and that's why I say that. Actually when you see that from Vietnam, last name Sam: all from a family. We have a big family, it’s a very big name in China too. Not popular like Li, or Chang, or something now, but it's a very big name in China. 

Mireya: But you were in Malaysia for two years, right? In the camp? How, what was that like?

Sam: Ahh, that's bad. It’s small, it’s an island only. 50,000 people, 55,000 people when the high reached in ‘79. It's very hot. And then they get no food, no water. We gotta take the ocean water to shower, live on the beach. For I think two weeks, that's it. No water to drink. How can you get water to shower? And then, they figured out, I think a month later, or eventually before they order the supply from the boat from another island, it take them like 2.5 hours to deliver all the food and water from there. 

Mireya: You've come a long way. 

Sam: It is. Everybody is just as much as me at the time. They get Vietnam-American experience. The worst thing, the worst refugee camp is my camp. This was a whole for all 50,000 people there. No food, no water. A lot of fighting. A lot of struggle for everything like that. Frustrating, it's bad... We get down here.

Mireya: So, my mom grew up in Hong Kong. She used to volunteer at a Vietnamese refugee camp. 

Sam: Hong Kong is very different!

Mireya: Yeah, it's different. Very different. 

Sam: They get food, water, everything you want. You know, better than you can consider the whole world in that time. The worst camp [Sam:’s] in the world. The help from UN, they came to the island. They came and see it and said, “Wow, you guys survive very good. You guys should have the rat disease.” Rats were bigger than the cat. They’re not just one, they all come together like a bunch of times. Hey, but we survive..

I think the camp is different now. No more. I tried to get back there one time, but it’s so hot now. I can't. Vietnam's hot. We go to Malaysia and Cambodia. Hotter. Hotter than Thailand is OK. So  I can't take it. I was sitting in the bus now. We gotta go. I gotta sit. It's life, my life. Not like, hey, I’ve seen a lot. I grew from the world. You know, we go to war all time. I left school. A soldier took over school, prepared for work. That's why, when people say I've been there and don't worry about it. I don't miss anything.

Mireya: Yeah, you said you have brothers here.

Sam: I brought my family over here back in 1992. The whole family. You love it. My younger brother, sister, I got my mom, my parents come over here in ‘92.

Mireya: How did you manage to have that happen?

Sam: Well, you work and you save money and then sponsor your family. Over here, I get married and have kids. My parents, my mom passed away before pandemic, like four years ago. Passed away around 2006. I was here in this country, your heart, and then you will get, everything would pay out later.

That's what I've been working for. I think that I work for people only. I’ve been working year after year. I opened my business, I opened my first restaurant in Chinatown back in ‘87. Since then, I've done my own business.

Mireya: Do you like working for yourself better?

Sam: Oh, yes. It's more pressure, you know? But you don't have to, what time to go to work and what time, take care of your boss and say, hey, you late today and your own business is different. You make a lot of pressure from business. Your own time, first opening restaurant in town, every first opening you can work hard when you expect it and people can work for you.

I've been free for 20 years. I didn't work for people, I just made it happen and then I got people working for me. 13 years. I travel a lot. I've been traveling a lot from Asia, in Asia, except Indonesia and Philippines and India. I didn't travel there. 

Mireya: That's us.

Sam: I've been traveling all around Asia, like Japan, Taiwan, Thailand, Singapore, Malaysia, China.

Mireya: What was your favorite place? 

Sam: My favorite place for travel is Malaysia. It's very nice there. China is good too, but China has so many super big cities. Shanghai and Guangzhou. You go to Guangzhou, you don't know how to catch a subway. You watch the subway, it can go anywhere. You can wait for taxi. It’s worse than back in Hong Kong, worse and the traffic. The rest is fine. The rest is good, right? Singapore got clean and then Taiwan is, it's not the construction. Thailand is OK. The food is good. Thailand is considered tourist, that's why the food is so so so good. The food is very burger and pies in Thailand. You travel, you learn a culture or a different variety of food and then people eat differently. 

Mireya: Does that influence what you guys make here?

Sam: That's what happened in America now today, different than 34 years ago when I was here. I remember that you see news only once in a while. You see murder. Something happened now, every day, every day was bad. I was like, what's going on? This country. The country changed a lot before. You never see a murder. Maybe once in a while for over a year, there was a murder like, every day. Like yesterday they take a shot in a high school. It’s like people crazy now. I don't know, I don't want people crazy. They think people change, you know, not a good way, in a bad way. 

Mireya: So you've seen a lot of things?

Sam: I'm 66 years old. I'm very lucky actually. I see four generations. For my generation, we see change. See, before our time we got no phone, even a home phone, no television. You may see a black and white television. You live in a very good condition and then it's simple but everywhere you go, even the poor country like China or everywhere you go, we got, you know, before you want to go dating and go, you can't call no phone. You gotta go to the house. When our doors open, that's all. With no phone, nothing. And then I get a phone, get Internet now. Lucky. I don’t know how to use the computer for immigrants, 60 years old. I don't think so many know. The people born here, they can teach me how to use it but not for immigrants. That's why I'm lucky. I see how to use it. That's all. But I'm no good with that. I'm slow but fly.

Mireya: Yeah. So you started in Chinatown in ‘87? You said you opened your first business in ‘87? Where was that?

Sam: It's called Family Peking the House. So back then, very popular. I do a lot of things that come along. All different business.

Mireya: Did you open Little Saigon after that?

Sam: I bought back in ‘87 and I need to open a restaurant in north. My credit, I quit. At that time, you read a newspaper, you read who sells tickets, airplane tickets. I cal him. All right. We don’t have a lot of money and send them a check. I sent my check. They send you a ticket. There’s no confirmation of the ticket. I tell her like, I don’t want to never know. Where am I? Like ‘93. I was up in Los Angeles.

Mireya: You went to Los Angeles? 

Sam: Los Angeles. I move back there one time and I stopped. I have a friend of mine and I just finally come back and try to get everything so I can move there. I stay here, but it's like a family problem. The family problem was their business and you just won't go away. You don't want anybody to find you. 

Mireya: So, when did you guys open this last year?

Sam: Last year, June. June is the anniversary. I don't know what I may do. Anniversary party. 

Mireya: You’ve been working in Chinatown or going to Chinatown for, since you've been in Philly?

Sam: I've been working in Chinatown on my first opening after that. I’ve been occupying for, 11th and Race Street. Then 11th, Race, and Cherry Street. My office on 10th Street. So I didn't do restaurant for 20 years. I didn’t work that hard. I surprised my new friends, my old friend. I’m back. So my new friends don’t drink and hustle around. When I open the restaurant and people ask, what are you crazy? I say, hey, I don’t know, this pandemic. Nothing to do. Shut it down. I want just to open this one up. I didn't know but it was hard to get people to help me. I thought I open it up. I got help in coming in. I pitched them. I do work, I do things and then that's it. I release myself now. Nine months now I'm still here. It’s tough to be in the restaurant business, the labor.

I wake up at nine o'clock and work until like one or two o'clock at night, in the morning. One time I would come home 4 30 in the morning and I could wake up at nine o'clock, you know, buy stuff and come back and work. That's why I said I need a break. We just opened, you don’t  want to die. I can't tell you I can't take anymore. I'm not young, I'm not 30 years old. If I were 30 years old, I can do it fine, but not my 65, 66 years. Come on, guy. 

I got a friend of mine who helps me out. He lives in the back of 11th. He's my age. He's helped me out at lunch time. So sometimes he let you come in and say, OK, I'll be over in 10 minutes. You know, friendship. For over 40 years from Hong Kong, from Vietnam. We met here and be a good friend that you need. You need a few good friends. A good friend will come to help without pay, money. So happy you have business.

Mireya: And you were in the Chinatown area when the other fights [against predatory development] were happening, right? 

Sam: 20 years ago, we fight there. Back to back, me and Debbie met. The stadium, I do that and with someone else. The same thing, the same fight. Where are we on? The same thing? Nobody knows what's going on. I find out from the news, I take my wife to the doctor three times a week. So one time like 10, 10 or 11 o'clock, I was sitting in the waiting room and then, hey, hey stadium. I was sitting there, “What's going on?” And then I was so, so angry. 

I went back to my office. I'm very angry. I told my reception, hold all my calls. I don't care who calling me. The first thing, I call my lawyer. Go on. I gotta do something. So what do you need? All right, Sam, I will set up petition for you that time. The email. Not that popular AOL. That's annoying. So he faxed over to me and it and I was sitting there. Tell him I need 1000 copies. And they sent me the first night. He said Wednesday evening because, at least find a sign, a list. The first weekend we set up table, we collect 10,000 [signatures].

Mireya: Oh my God.

Sam: Awesome. People still sign in, sign up. I don't even belong to any association. I don't care. And then suddenly here, come on talking to me. So I talked to CBA [Chinese Benevolent Association]. So when we talk and then I say, OK, let's take over that. I said we would do a petition signing every weekend now. I'm happy with that. Why? Because I do my part of 10 people and I'm happy. So the chairman come to me saying, what's going on? We need you. I said you don't need that. You got a lot of people there. They said no, we need you. So I come back to the CBA and we structure everything. My title at the time, CBA executive director. And then I come back there, with control structure,everything together with the stadium.

Mireya: Sam's the man.

Sam: We talk, I said, why not? That's why we started. Back then it was easier. It’s less association. There are 18, less than 20 associations. So easy control to speak out. So now we got almost 100. It’s tough. I'm a new immigrant now, old generation. Different generation now. 

Mireya: You're a working man.

Sam: I have no time. I'm sure I got no time for 20 years. And suddenly a friend of mine texted me the inquiry. And then Debbie texted me, she texted me that Chinatown, 50% agree with that to talk to all of our community. I saw the member leaders, they are all for it and 50% for that. Only a small group of people make a big noise. So they come over, we talk and I send out the investment to all associates in Chinatown. Nobody showed up. It was for associate program. We start to tell what's going on from there. The meeting, all together supported. The year I was in CBA is a powerful year for Chinatown. So we started here, we’re talking about what’s going on. I can call somebody up to give me a Chinese version. They give me the English version. I do a Chinese version. I got some kids, I said you gotta do it for me. And then finally put a poster again, and one night we post up from 8:30 with the whole crew. Post all around Chinatown. And the next night we get another 50. I think we have a 100. But then next night we came out to do it again. The cop come over again. They just said, don’t post. Ok, there’s a little drama. Then some business called, “Why you got posted?” I say, excuse me, tell them to call me. Look for me. That thing for community here. That’s what happened and they say that was a done deal. It’s different now, but same thing 20 years ago.

Mireya: So today, a big struggle is getting everyone in Chinatown to be against the arena right now. We have more people now. But when you were doing the Phillies stadium and stuff like that, was that not a thing? Was just everyone against it? 

Sam: Before I say, only had to get 20 [associations] and they were all against. All the best donate money, that time like everybody. Don't do any work for a community without money. 

Mireya: What do you think has changed now? Because in the beginning, there were so many businesses here that were OK with the arena, that wanted it. What do you think has changed since then?

Sam: Well, first thing is they don't have enough information. It was a rumor, and then the rumor said it’s a done deal. That's a blessing. Even a friend of mine outside of the city, some American people came in and they will say, I thought you are for it. They say no, we're not for it. We got the media, the newspaper in there. So today I look at the town meetings and the things we are doing now. I say to people when this thing explode, the more exposed it is, the more chance for us to win. 

Mireya: How did you feel in the town meeting?

Sam: It's our time, really good in that meeting. Nobody is yelling. Time. We should be yelling. In our time, we made a lot of noise. Let the people express themselves. Wait, they don't let them talk. No, we shut them down. They're lying. That's it. OK? Shut them. We'll challenge it from now on. If there is a meeting in Chinatown, it should be on camera to the media. We challenge your answers. 

Mireya: Is there a certain place in Chinatown that means a lot to you? Would it be this restaurant or would it be somewhere else?

Sam: The whole town means a lot to me, not just a certain spot. The whole town. I grew up in this town as well. I grew with this town. When I came in, nothing. Like Race Street and 10th, that corner and that's it, the main spot. 10th and Race, that’s it. 10th and Arch? Nothing. Only got one bakery.

Mireya: Really? But now, 10th and Arch is great. 

Sam: Before when I came here, no supermarket and one brick on the street and the command center was small. And that's it. No restaurant. That's it. There's nothing like now you got. I grew this community. That’s why I know. I know what’s going on. 

Mireya: It’s really amazing how you've made this place a headquarters in the past.

Sam: Well, it's a thing like this. You’re gonna need a place to hold meetings. It’s the second floor. Not used that much for parties only. So, I figured out why not just use it as a headquarters.

Mireya: I love your mindset. How you're just like, we're going to win. There's no other option. We're going to win.

Sam: Yeah, it's a lot of going on this town, people against something. I’m happy I can help. That’s why I help. I was like 20 years ago. I know a lot of people.

Mireya: it seems like everyone knows you. Everyone calls you Uncle Sam, that's so cute.

Sam: Well, I'm not going, I can’t deny that. The stadium thing, Mid-Autumn Festival, who started that. Who brought it back? The first year back in Chinatown, had to pull up. I make it happen. Now, I'm 66. Of my people, some 70 [years old], 80, or pass away. 

Mireya: You told us so many good things and bad things. But they are important. 

Sam: That's life. That's life. That's my life. My life, I do a movie.

Mireya: I’d love to watch the Sam movie. It was really nice hearing your story. Thank you so much for doing this. Thank you.